The York Federation of Students elections closed this weekend, and the results were announced yesterday. The progress not politics slate which I supported, along with everyone I associate myself with, did not get elected. Suffice it to say, the left-wing socialist side of York has resurfaced. NOW - here's the irony. I'm left wing and socialist! You think I'd be happy with the results. Sadly, I'm not.
I was having a discussion a few nights ago where I said that even though I'm left-wing, I don't associate with left-wingers at York - most, if not all, of them have extremely negative sentiments towards Israel. Most of them are just looking for an anarchic way to fight the man. I also don't feel that the left wing parties at York are well equiped to lead the school. Well, we'll see. As the progress not politics website is saying right now "You made your bed. Hope you can lie in it?" One thing is for certain - it's going to be an interesting semester.
Tuesday, November 30, 2004
Monday, November 29, 2004
Savage Love
This morning, I leave you with an article from NOW magazine. It's by Dan Savage. Normally he's all sexual and perverse, but I think he has some interesting stuff here:
Dear Dan,
I know your liberal heart means well, Dan, but the response you gave to SAUDI typifies much
that is wrong with the Western attitude toward the Middle East. While SAUDI is partially to blame for having the poor judgment to ask you about sexual ethics, your statement, "Unlike the country you left behind, there are no morals police in the part of North America where you live" smacks of haughty, imperialistic condescension. You totally ignored the fact that the values SAUDI was taught as a Muslim have a deep and completely valid cultural context that needs to be considered when dispensing advice. You reduced the conundrum of a devout man experiencing serious cultural conflict to the influence of the "morals police," and in quite a smirking tone. I don't care how progressive Canadians are. It is incredibly offensive to imply the superiority of morals in Canada to values taught in Saudi Arabia. To paraphrase Gandhi, have some goddamn cultural sensitivity, man.
- Sick Of Stereotypes
Dear SOS:
Did I imply the superiority of morals in Canada to values taught in Saudi Arabia? Jesus H. Christ, SOS, I feel terrible about that. So let me set the record straight: I never meant to imply the superiority of morals in Canada to values taught in Saudi Arabia. I meant to state, loudly and clearly and for the record, the absolute superiority of morals in Canada to values taught in Saudi Arabia.
Let us count the ways in which Canada is superior: equality of the sexes, political and religious pluralism, a little thing called democracy and, of course, the radical notion that consenting adults are free to have sex with other consenting adults without having to worry about being lashed or having their heads cut off in public. Canada's also got vodka tonics, BC bud and pornography going for it, along with Tim Hortons, pork-sausage gravy on fries and a just and equitable social-welfare system. Is Canada morally superior to Saudi Arabia? You bet.
It's also morally superior to the United States of America.
But back to the big SA. Unless you believe that cutting off the heads of homosexuals has a "deep and completely valid cultural context" or men treating women as their property is a "value," you have to acknowledge that Saudi Arabia practises and promotes a thoroughly fucked-up brand of Islam. Furthermore, Saudi Arabia's state-sanctioned "morals police" are not, as you imply, an imperialistic fantasy of mine. They are, sadly, a fact of everyday life for Saudi Arabian women, gays, atheists, moderate/non-Wahabi Muslims and anyone else who fails to live up to the pinched, sex-negative, deeply psychotic brand of monotheism practised there. To paraphrase the United Nation's Universal Declaration Of Human Rights, I believe that human
rights are universal, man. As Saudi Arabia exists in this universe, I think that the humans there – Muslim or not, liberal or conservative, male or female, gay or straight – are entitled to their full human rights. Until that day comes, SOS, I'm going to go right on thinking that Canada kicks Saudi Arabia's ass when it comes to morals and values. And bud.
Dear Dan,
I know your liberal heart means well, Dan, but the response you gave to SAUDI typifies much
that is wrong with the Western attitude toward the Middle East. While SAUDI is partially to blame for having the poor judgment to ask you about sexual ethics, your statement, "Unlike the country you left behind, there are no morals police in the part of North America where you live" smacks of haughty, imperialistic condescension. You totally ignored the fact that the values SAUDI was taught as a Muslim have a deep and completely valid cultural context that needs to be considered when dispensing advice. You reduced the conundrum of a devout man experiencing serious cultural conflict to the influence of the "morals police," and in quite a smirking tone. I don't care how progressive Canadians are. It is incredibly offensive to imply the superiority of morals in Canada to values taught in Saudi Arabia. To paraphrase Gandhi, have some goddamn cultural sensitivity, man.
- Sick Of Stereotypes
Dear SOS:
Did I imply the superiority of morals in Canada to values taught in Saudi Arabia? Jesus H. Christ, SOS, I feel terrible about that. So let me set the record straight: I never meant to imply the superiority of morals in Canada to values taught in Saudi Arabia. I meant to state, loudly and clearly and for the record, the absolute superiority of morals in Canada to values taught in Saudi Arabia.
Let us count the ways in which Canada is superior: equality of the sexes, political and religious pluralism, a little thing called democracy and, of course, the radical notion that consenting adults are free to have sex with other consenting adults without having to worry about being lashed or having their heads cut off in public. Canada's also got vodka tonics, BC bud and pornography going for it, along with Tim Hortons, pork-sausage gravy on fries and a just and equitable social-welfare system. Is Canada morally superior to Saudi Arabia? You bet.
It's also morally superior to the United States of America.
But back to the big SA. Unless you believe that cutting off the heads of homosexuals has a "deep and completely valid cultural context" or men treating women as their property is a "value," you have to acknowledge that Saudi Arabia practises and promotes a thoroughly fucked-up brand of Islam. Furthermore, Saudi Arabia's state-sanctioned "morals police" are not, as you imply, an imperialistic fantasy of mine. They are, sadly, a fact of everyday life for Saudi Arabian women, gays, atheists, moderate/non-Wahabi Muslims and anyone else who fails to live up to the pinched, sex-negative, deeply psychotic brand of monotheism practised there. To paraphrase the United Nation's Universal Declaration Of Human Rights, I believe that human
rights are universal, man. As Saudi Arabia exists in this universe, I think that the humans there – Muslim or not, liberal or conservative, male or female, gay or straight – are entitled to their full human rights. Until that day comes, SOS, I'm going to go right on thinking that Canada kicks Saudi Arabia's ass when it comes to morals and values. And bud.
dichotomous struggle
I'm not a doctor. . . Or a fireman. . . I work in the theatre. . .
Which is not to say that my work is unimportant. . . But it is not life threatening. . .It is not more important than spending time with my family. . .
~found this in somebody's blog. I like it. it resonates for me.
I had a dramatically theatre-filled day:
I can envision myself as a rabbi and I worry that I'll lose all touch with theatre (aside from watching it). But then I envision myself as an actor/director/designer and worry that I'd be straying away from something that I've wanted to be since I was eight.
So there's the dichotomous struggle. I like that phrase - I used it in an essay last week. I also used the word "expunge," and that really impressed my prof!
Any suggestions? And please don't tell me I can do both, because it's really not feasible. And I'm not asking for people to tell me who or what to be, I'm just at a loss and I have been for a few years. Help?
Which is not to say that my work is unimportant. . . But it is not life threatening. . .It is not more important than spending time with my family. . .
~found this in somebody's blog. I like it. it resonates for me.
I had a dramatically theatre-filled day:
- I woke up to about 20 Jewish women in my living room courtesy of my mother, which is more than enough DRAMA, let me tell you.
- I went out for lunch with Dave and Natalia (both from the theatre)
- I missed Ruddigore rehearsal - causing great drama amongst the cast :-)
- But I missed it to do some lighting tech for a local community theatre - they were doing Shrek 2 - how cute!
- This evening, I applied for a position at Factory Theatre - this is very exciting for me! We'll see where it goes!
I can envision myself as a rabbi and I worry that I'll lose all touch with theatre (aside from watching it). But then I envision myself as an actor/director/designer and worry that I'd be straying away from something that I've wanted to be since I was eight.
So there's the dichotomous struggle. I like that phrase - I used it in an essay last week. I also used the word "expunge," and that really impressed my prof!
Any suggestions? And please don't tell me I can do both, because it's really not feasible. And I'm not asking for people to tell me who or what to be, I'm just at a loss and I have been for a few years. Help?
Sunday, November 28, 2004
What's with this shit? I'm not even American!
|
You Are a New School Democrat |
 You like partying and politics - and are likely to be young and affluent. You're less religious, traditional, and uptight than most Democrats. Smoking pot, homosexuality, and gambling are all okay in your book. You prefer that the government help people take care of themselves. |
4:00am - Philosophy on MSN - I think I'm saved!
I think I may finally have something to write my essay on! Cheers to 4am philosophizing on msn :-)
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
unfortunately, modern socialism is becoming very similar to anarchism
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
"fight the power"
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
quite true
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
in any case, economically, I don't think comunism can work on a large scale..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
its useful for kibutzim-style communities, but that's about it..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
it takes work and a true understanding
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
it's easy on a small scale, but not impossible on a large scale
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
when you factor in human psychology, greed is always there..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
truly, I don't expect it to ever work large scale
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
there will always be one person to screw it up
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
then you have the issue of people who work harder deserve more than those who don't work at all..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
sadly, I don't see any political party attentive to the needs of canadians
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
(with exceptions of the disabled, etc..)
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
out of curiousity, what do u think about the issue of some people working harder than others?
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
do they deserve more?
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
depends on what you classify as working harder
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
if, for example, 2 people do the same job..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
one does 20 hours a week, and the other does 50 hours a week
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
does the caretaker at york who works 10-10 everyday work harder than a neurophysicist?
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
should they both have the same standard of living?
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
well, that's what marxist communism about - standard of living
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
it doesn't say that everyone makes the same, it says that everyone makes what they need for their standard of living
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
a single maintenance worker has a lower standard of living than a married one, etc etc
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
so does it allow for people to have 3rd world standards of living?
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
no
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
or bill gates standards?
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
and no - bill gates lives far above the necessities of life
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
and undeveloped countries live far below it
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
ok.. so two single men, both work doing the same thing, but one works twice as long/hard as the other..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
do they get the same 'pay'?
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
or does the guy who choses to work longer hours in order so that he can enjoy a big screen tv not have such an opportunity?
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
if you understand marxist communism as a contract system - you still need to work to recieve pay
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
understood..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
but can I choose to go above and beyond because I enjoy more 'extravagant' things than others do?
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
no
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
that's quite clear
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
people won't be happy in such a society..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
for example..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
I'm happy eating pizza and fast food..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
oh for sure people wouldn't be happy
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
its very cheap to produce, etc..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
assuming food was an only factor..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
but what if I'm not happy with our "democracy"
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
I'd be happy with pizza and pasta, etc.. but most people in today's society want more 'fancy' foods..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
if they want it, they should be able to have it.. assuming they work that much harder for it..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
ideally, such foods would be available not only to an elite
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
try telling a kibbutnik that there's a part of the kibbutz that only certain people can go to where there's better food and more commodities
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
but someone who wanted a steak would require that there be a guy who raises cattle, another who slaughters the cattle, another who processes it, and another who cooks it..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
and that's how a kibbutz works
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
so u have 10 people working for the guy who wants a stake, but only 2 for the guy who wants some fries..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
is that truly communal?
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
can I then ask, since I only eat (hypothetically) fries, that I have 8 servants working for me to make up the difference?
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
hypothetically no - you're entitled to the steak just as much as anyone else is. if you choose not to exercize your right, that's your own choice
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
this is where a financial based society would make more sence..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
to some
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
it might be more ideal to try a spin on it..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
give everyone $10000 / year.. spend it on whatever you want..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
or again.. based on need
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
that would certainly be interesting
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
but then u end up again with lazy people who won't be productive in their jobs..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
since they know they're guaranteed "pay", why should they care about their work?
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
for the betterment of society?
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
I know it's idealist
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
the point is, unless humans become like robots, there is no way that communism can work
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
the will of the human is higher than intellect..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
and the will of the human is driven by the need to (what they believe is for the) improvement of themselves in one way or another
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
which means the human will always want more something
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
more money, more spirituality, more friends, more books..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
knowledge..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
if the will is higher than intellect, can one will to have mor intellect?
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
sure
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
that's one of my 'will's'
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
I believe some want more intellect and it is for them that communism wourl work
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
what if I want more intellect than others..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
then you're a selfish bastard
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
not necessarily..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
remember, people are competetive..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
true
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
now you're getting into social contract theory
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
in the science world.. which I'm more familiar with..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
which is about escaping the nature of humanity - hobbes, locke, rousseau - they all saw human nature as something to be escaped by entering into a social contract form of government
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
all important pieces of intellect are shared and published..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
but, everyone competes to be the First to make an advancement in a particular field of science
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
right
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
if they're not the first, they don't get recognized for their work..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
and as a result, they will to be the first..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
you could consider it selfish..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
but you could also argue that their work ends up getting wasted if they're not the first..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
all true
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
I don't necessarily agree that democracy is the best way to go about things either..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
in some cases, it is..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
but in any case, its absolutley necessary to have an economic system that's somewhat based on capitalism
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
I don't think it's absolutely necessary in all societies - but I think for us, it's important to recognize that we are a capital based economy
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
as far as history goes.. it has always been a system based on how hard you work, or how much you earn..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
ideally, you should be respected based on your talents and how hard you work..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
not because of your money
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
so do we sit back and say "this is the way it's always been, so be it"
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
I don't like the status quo
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
do u agree that someone should be respected based on their talents and the amount of work they do?
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
or alternatively, that everyone should be treated equally, as a number, but not a face..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
I think everyone has different talents
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
agreed..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
and you should be respected based on how you use your own talents
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
agreed..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
to me.. I'd be interested in meeting people with a certain set of talents to help me in my life.. but you'd likely look for help from people with a different set of talents..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
which is normal.. otherwise, there would be no individuality..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
for example.. I like a certain kind of music
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
and a certain type of food.. etc.
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
I wouldn't care to go to the person who makes the best steak..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
not if suddenly.. everybody wanted a steak, there is more demand on the steak guy..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
he has to work harder..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
as a result, he deserves more respect for his hard work
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
otherwise, people won't get equal opportunity to their right to eat steak
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
since the steak guy will no longer have motivation to cook for a lot of people..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
so.. what would a communist society do in such a scenario?
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
hmm
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
they could get more people making steak
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
but they're not necessarily talented doing that..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
there will still be demand on this first guy
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
why should he have to work harder than everyone else?
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
it's a tough scenario
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
I'll tell you what I'd do..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
tell everyone that if they want steak, they have to work as hard as the guy who makes it..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
so.. as a result.. some people will decide they're not willing to do that..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
the demand on the steak guy goes down..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
and those willing to work harder will
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
what did we ultimately create?
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
an idealistic model?
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
if you call it that..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
I call it capitalism
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
those who chose to work harder in order to enjoy those 'finer things' that are in higher demand.. do so
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
I just instituted a system of supply and demand
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
and a system of 'cost'
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
but there should still be a base line which provides basic needs for all
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
as well as inflation
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
ok.. so everyone gets shelter and 2 basic meals per day..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
how do you guarantee that EVERYONE's basic needs are cared for?
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
but if you want a TV, you have to work
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
if you're talented like the steak guy.. u can get a big screen
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
so your basic needs are provided for by the government, but if you want more you need to work more for it
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
sounds fair..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
no?
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
I never heard of any government saying that they should let the homeless rot on the street
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
but if they don't do anything to get them off, then it basically amounts to the same
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
not necesarily..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
everyone also needs to have exactly the same opportunity to work more for more
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
which we don't have
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
if all the facilities are provided, and the homless still chose not to accept them.. what more can you do?
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
very few homeless choose to live on the street
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
agreed..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
but those who don't stay in shelters, do chose not to..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
if homeless shelters were rejecting people who truly needed it, I'm sure we'd be hearing about it..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
they do
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
and we do hear of it - shelters are overcrowed - not nearly enough room or money
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
I'm not arguing about overcrowding and money
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
but do they tell people that they can't come in ?
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
sometimes
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
that needs to be fixed..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
indeed
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
alternatively..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
instead of having government run shelters.
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
BUT! more importantly - shelters aren't the same baseline standard of living that a home and money for food is
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
shelters provide home and food.. unfortunately, they're not up to the standard of living of an average family that makes $50000/year
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
exactly
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
but that average family works hard for it..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
the argument really is how much should they get for free?
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
I think 50 square feet and 2 meals is enough to survive..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
as well as some clothing.. in order for them to go out and make an effort to improve their standard of living..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
that's a whole separate thing
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
ya.. different path anyway..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
unfortunately, modern socialism is becoming very similar to anarchism
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
"fight the power"
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
quite true
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
in any case, economically, I don't think comunism can work on a large scale..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
its useful for kibutzim-style communities, but that's about it..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
it takes work and a true understanding
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
it's easy on a small scale, but not impossible on a large scale
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
when you factor in human psychology, greed is always there..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
truly, I don't expect it to ever work large scale
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
there will always be one person to screw it up
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
then you have the issue of people who work harder deserve more than those who don't work at all..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
sadly, I don't see any political party attentive to the needs of canadians
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
(with exceptions of the disabled, etc..)
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
out of curiousity, what do u think about the issue of some people working harder than others?
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
do they deserve more?
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
depends on what you classify as working harder
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
if, for example, 2 people do the same job..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
one does 20 hours a week, and the other does 50 hours a week
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
does the caretaker at york who works 10-10 everyday work harder than a neurophysicist?
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
should they both have the same standard of living?
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
well, that's what marxist communism about - standard of living
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
it doesn't say that everyone makes the same, it says that everyone makes what they need for their standard of living
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
a single maintenance worker has a lower standard of living than a married one, etc etc
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
so does it allow for people to have 3rd world standards of living?
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
no
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
or bill gates standards?
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
and no - bill gates lives far above the necessities of life
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
and undeveloped countries live far below it
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
ok.. so two single men, both work doing the same thing, but one works twice as long/hard as the other..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
do they get the same 'pay'?
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
or does the guy who choses to work longer hours in order so that he can enjoy a big screen tv not have such an opportunity?
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
if you understand marxist communism as a contract system - you still need to work to recieve pay
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
understood..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
but can I choose to go above and beyond because I enjoy more 'extravagant' things than others do?
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
no
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
that's quite clear
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
people won't be happy in such a society..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
for example..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
I'm happy eating pizza and fast food..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
oh for sure people wouldn't be happy
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
its very cheap to produce, etc..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
assuming food was an only factor..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
but what if I'm not happy with our "democracy"
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
I'd be happy with pizza and pasta, etc.. but most people in today's society want more 'fancy' foods..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
if they want it, they should be able to have it.. assuming they work that much harder for it..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
ideally, such foods would be available not only to an elite
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
try telling a kibbutnik that there's a part of the kibbutz that only certain people can go to where there's better food and more commodities
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
but someone who wanted a steak would require that there be a guy who raises cattle, another who slaughters the cattle, another who processes it, and another who cooks it..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
and that's how a kibbutz works
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
so u have 10 people working for the guy who wants a stake, but only 2 for the guy who wants some fries..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
is that truly communal?
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
can I then ask, since I only eat (hypothetically) fries, that I have 8 servants working for me to make up the difference?
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
hypothetically no - you're entitled to the steak just as much as anyone else is. if you choose not to exercize your right, that's your own choice
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
this is where a financial based society would make more sence..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
to some
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
it might be more ideal to try a spin on it..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
give everyone $10000 / year.. spend it on whatever you want..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
or again.. based on need
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
that would certainly be interesting
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
but then u end up again with lazy people who won't be productive in their jobs..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
since they know they're guaranteed "pay", why should they care about their work?
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
for the betterment of society?
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
I know it's idealist
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
the point is, unless humans become like robots, there is no way that communism can work
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
the will of the human is higher than intellect..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
and the will of the human is driven by the need to (what they believe is for the) improvement of themselves in one way or another
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
which means the human will always want more something
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
more money, more spirituality, more friends, more books..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
knowledge..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
if the will is higher than intellect, can one will to have mor intellect?
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
sure
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
that's one of my 'will's'
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
I believe some want more intellect and it is for them that communism wourl work
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
what if I want more intellect than others..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
then you're a selfish bastard
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
not necessarily..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
remember, people are competetive..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
true
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
now you're getting into social contract theory
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
in the science world.. which I'm more familiar with..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
which is about escaping the nature of humanity - hobbes, locke, rousseau - they all saw human nature as something to be escaped by entering into a social contract form of government
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
all important pieces of intellect are shared and published..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
but, everyone competes to be the First to make an advancement in a particular field of science
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
right
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
if they're not the first, they don't get recognized for their work..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
and as a result, they will to be the first..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
you could consider it selfish..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
but you could also argue that their work ends up getting wasted if they're not the first..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
all true
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
I don't necessarily agree that democracy is the best way to go about things either..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
in some cases, it is..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
but in any case, its absolutley necessary to have an economic system that's somewhat based on capitalism
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
I don't think it's absolutely necessary in all societies - but I think for us, it's important to recognize that we are a capital based economy
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
as far as history goes.. it has always been a system based on how hard you work, or how much you earn..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
ideally, you should be respected based on your talents and how hard you work..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
not because of your money
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
so do we sit back and say "this is the way it's always been, so be it"
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
I don't like the status quo
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
do u agree that someone should be respected based on their talents and the amount of work they do?
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
or alternatively, that everyone should be treated equally, as a number, but not a face..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
I think everyone has different talents
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
agreed..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
and you should be respected based on how you use your own talents
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
agreed..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
to me.. I'd be interested in meeting people with a certain set of talents to help me in my life.. but you'd likely look for help from people with a different set of talents..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
which is normal.. otherwise, there would be no individuality..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
for example.. I like a certain kind of music
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
and a certain type of food.. etc.
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
I wouldn't care to go to the person who makes the best steak..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
not if suddenly.. everybody wanted a steak, there is more demand on the steak guy..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
he has to work harder..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
as a result, he deserves more respect for his hard work
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
otherwise, people won't get equal opportunity to their right to eat steak
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
since the steak guy will no longer have motivation to cook for a lot of people..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
so.. what would a communist society do in such a scenario?
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
hmm
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
they could get more people making steak
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
but they're not necessarily talented doing that..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
there will still be demand on this first guy
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
why should he have to work harder than everyone else?
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
it's a tough scenario
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
I'll tell you what I'd do..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
tell everyone that if they want steak, they have to work as hard as the guy who makes it..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
so.. as a result.. some people will decide they're not willing to do that..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
the demand on the steak guy goes down..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
and those willing to work harder will
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
what did we ultimately create?
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
an idealistic model?
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
if you call it that..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
I call it capitalism
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
those who chose to work harder in order to enjoy those 'finer things' that are in higher demand.. do so
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
I just instituted a system of supply and demand
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
and a system of 'cost'
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
but there should still be a base line which provides basic needs for all
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
as well as inflation
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
ok.. so everyone gets shelter and 2 basic meals per day..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
how do you guarantee that EVERYONE's basic needs are cared for?
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
but if you want a TV, you have to work
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
if you're talented like the steak guy.. u can get a big screen
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
so your basic needs are provided for by the government, but if you want more you need to work more for it
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
sounds fair..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
no?
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
I never heard of any government saying that they should let the homeless rot on the street
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
but if they don't do anything to get them off, then it basically amounts to the same
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
not necesarily..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
everyone also needs to have exactly the same opportunity to work more for more
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
which we don't have
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
if all the facilities are provided, and the homless still chose not to accept them.. what more can you do?
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
very few homeless choose to live on the street
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
agreed..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
but those who don't stay in shelters, do chose not to..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
if homeless shelters were rejecting people who truly needed it, I'm sure we'd be hearing about it..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
they do
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
and we do hear of it - shelters are overcrowed - not nearly enough room or money
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
I'm not arguing about overcrowding and money
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
but do they tell people that they can't come in ?
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
sometimes
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
that needs to be fixed..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
indeed
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
alternatively..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
instead of having government run shelters.
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
BUT! more importantly - shelters aren't the same baseline standard of living that a home and money for food is
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
shelters provide home and food.. unfortunately, they're not up to the standard of living of an average family that makes $50000/year
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
exactly
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
but that average family works hard for it..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
the argument really is how much should they get for free?
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
I think 50 square feet and 2 meals is enough to survive..
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
as well as some clothing.. in order for them to go out and make an effort to improve their standard of living..
Jesse --> 30 days to Israel!!! [phantomphilosopher.blogspot.com] says:
that's a whole separate thing
Mr & Mrs DJStealth says:
ya.. different path anyway..
Saturday, November 27, 2004
America the beautiful? America the sexually safe!
The Republican National Committee announced that the Republican Party is changing its emblem from an elephant to a condom. The committee chairman explained that the condom more clearly reflects the party's stance today, because a condom accepts inflation, halts production, destroys the next generation, protects a bunch of pricks, and gives you a sense of security while you're actually getting screwed.
you are here
"the story knows more than you do, let the story tell itself."
a quote from one of my favourite Daniel MacIvor plays. So - if the story (presumably my story, i.e the story of my life) knows more than I do and I'm supposed to let it tell itself - what's my place in this story - do I get to define my life, or does it just happen while I'm an impartial spectator?
Pardon my existential jabber, but my existentialism class has made me realize that there is a VAST amount of contradiction in existential philosophy. I'm still intrigued by it - I wouldn't call myself an existentialist, but there is a lot about it that I like - responsibility, freedom, etc etc etc. So if you're supposed to let the story tell itself - where's the freedom in that?
I'm leaving that as an open ended question right now. I'm not answering it. Maybe I'll answer it later.
My story right now is that I have a political philosophy paper to work on that was due last wednesday. I haven't really gotten anywhere with it, and it's really upsetting me because I'm engrossed in the class and the readings, but I can't get this essay to make any sense. I need to finish it this weekend, but it doesn't look like that is going to happen. "Ethical Leadership within Rousseau's Social Contract". It's incredibly interesting, it's right up my alley, but for some reason I can't get it going. And I'm not actively procrastinating (or maybe I am ???) so what the fuck.
I spent the morning watching "The Greatest Canadian" - George Stromboulopolus was arguing that Tommy Douglas (a premier of Saskatchewan - founded Universal Health Care) should be numero uno -- and I most definately agree. Go check out the site to see why: TOMMY DOUGLAS, GREATEST CANADIAN
I slept on the couch downstairs last night - couldn't fall asleep upstairs, not sure why. Or maybe I am sure why - anxious about this essay. most definately.
Let's see if I can get motivated and work on it.
a quote from one of my favourite Daniel MacIvor plays. So - if the story (presumably my story, i.e the story of my life) knows more than I do and I'm supposed to let it tell itself - what's my place in this story - do I get to define my life, or does it just happen while I'm an impartial spectator?
Pardon my existential jabber, but my existentialism class has made me realize that there is a VAST amount of contradiction in existential philosophy. I'm still intrigued by it - I wouldn't call myself an existentialist, but there is a lot about it that I like - responsibility, freedom, etc etc etc. So if you're supposed to let the story tell itself - where's the freedom in that?
I'm leaving that as an open ended question right now. I'm not answering it. Maybe I'll answer it later.
My story right now is that I have a political philosophy paper to work on that was due last wednesday. I haven't really gotten anywhere with it, and it's really upsetting me because I'm engrossed in the class and the readings, but I can't get this essay to make any sense. I need to finish it this weekend, but it doesn't look like that is going to happen. "Ethical Leadership within Rousseau's Social Contract". It's incredibly interesting, it's right up my alley, but for some reason I can't get it going. And I'm not actively procrastinating (or maybe I am ???) so what the fuck.
I spent the morning watching "The Greatest Canadian" - George Stromboulopolus was arguing that Tommy Douglas (a premier of Saskatchewan - founded Universal Health Care) should be numero uno -- and I most definately agree. Go check out the site to see why: TOMMY DOUGLAS, GREATEST CANADIAN
I slept on the couch downstairs last night - couldn't fall asleep upstairs, not sure why. Or maybe I am sure why - anxious about this essay. most definately.
Let's see if I can get motivated and work on it.
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